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Postby JenR » Sun Sep 06, 2009 8:04 pm

my phone just texted me a random fact from Apple.

"Almost 20% of the billions of dollar American taxpayer are spending to rebuild Iraq are lost to theft, kickbacks and corruption."
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Postby buttsie » Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:00 pm

JenR wrote:my phone just texted me a random fact from Apple.

"Almost 20% of the billions of dollar American taxpayer are spending to rebuild Iraq are lost to theft, kickbacks and corruption."



Been happening for a long time on all sides

$23 BILLION lost or stolen in Iraq by American contractors and corrupt officials

http://outtheotherear.wordpress.com/200 ... officials/

Federal authorities examining the early, chaotic days of the $125 billion American-led effort to rebuild Iraq have significantly broadened their inquiry to include senior American military officers who oversaw the program, according to interviews with senior government officials and court documents.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/15/world ... 5iraq.html
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Postby JenR » Mon Sep 07, 2009 1:15 am

i dont think our money should be forced to pay to rebuild that place.
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Postby buttsie » Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:02 am

JenR wrote:i dont think our money should be forced to pay to rebuild that place.


Most of "your money" used to rebuild IRAQ is going straight back into "American companies pockets" which will then in turn be paid out as tax to the government,salaries & dividneds to american citizens.In the same way that when America gives foreign aid it always stipulates that american companies must be used to supply & implement it.

So its not all money down the proverbial blackhole

Rather sad when war is used to stimulate economic growth :evil:
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Postby Spoonbat » Mon Sep 07, 2009 6:22 am

What kills me is when Republicans bitch about socialized health care and 'pork.'

Whatever your opinion on socialized health care -- the war in Iraq IS PORK. It is the biggest single item pork barrel wastrel on our fucking federal balance sheet.

These people have the nerve to call socialized healthcare 'too pricey' but their botched war isn't too expensive? The fuck?

I LONG for the days when Republicans at least had brains and enough self-introspection to at least get their party platform in line.

Let me get this straight - they don't have money for their own people and yet they have money for foreigners and corrupt multinationals?

And they gave Bush 2 terms?

If a Republican loses his/her job and if they voted for that moron, they deserve to lose their job if they're targeted for a termination.

As for the Republicans, they don't make for very good politicians.

Every politician knows that in order to do their job properly they have to bring money to THEIR people.

This is a party that knowingly committed suicide by shoveling cash out to foreigners by the boat load.

These people are so incompetent at their job they deserve to be thrown out of office.
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Postby Huc » Mon Sep 07, 2009 7:43 am

What kills me is when Democrats bitch about Iraq war and 'pork.'

Whatever your opinion on Iraq War -- the socialize healthcare IS PORK. It is the biggest single item pork barrel wastrel on our fucking federal balance sheet.

These people have the nerve to call Iraq war 'too pricey' but their botched socialized healthcare plan isn't too expensive? The fuck?

I LONG for the days when Democrats at least had brains and enough self-introspection to at least get their party platform in line.

Let me get this straight - they don't have money for their own people and yet they have money for foreigners and foreign aid?

And they want Obama for 2 terms?

If a Democrat loses his/her job and if they voted for that moron, they deserve to lose their job if they're targeted for a termination.

As for the Democrats, they don't make for very good politicians.

Every politician knows that in order to do their job properly they have to bring money to THEIR people.

This is a party that knowingly committed suicide by shoveling cash out to foreigners and social programs by the boat load.

These people are so incompetent at their job they deserve to be thrown out of office.




:wink:
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Postby buttsie » Mon Sep 07, 2009 8:02 am

Democrat or Republican makes little difference as both have track records of alllowing Big Business to continually screw the public

Incompetent is about as good as both sides of government get thesedays

Until the next disaster
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Postby maverick88 » Tue Sep 08, 2009 9:19 pm

JenR wrote:Any here that Obama is trying to pass a bill in the senate where he can have full control over the internet?


fuck that shit. i spit in his face, if that happens.



i don't know the whole story, any care to fill me in on it?


Yep Jen, I heard about that. I guess it's supposed to be only in cases of a national emergency, I think the bill is still in Congress behind closed doors in the middle of the night of course. :roll:
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Postby Spoonbat » Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:03 pm

Clever huckster, but keep in mind, the money to pay for the war is leaving our shores. The money being blown here, love it or hate it, is at least being recycled back into our economy.
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Postby Huc » Wed Sep 09, 2009 11:33 pm

So you agree that we don't need foreign aid? :wink:

The money to pay for the war usually goes back to the DoD. You gotta pay soldiers, ammos, guns, equipments.
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Postby Spoonbat » Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:43 am

Come on man, you know better than that. My buddy spent 14 months over there back in 04-05. They paid him, get this, a meager 44K when all was said and done. And that included hazard-duty pay and all that other special crap thrown on top.

NOW -- a 'security contractor' made 300K a yr. for a similar 'detachment.'(albeit with 3 less months than my friend)

And guess who paid for it. His "contractor" paid for it through a no-bid contract given to him from my fucking tax money.

Sure, the troops were paid - but that was a drop in the bucket in comparison to who really got the big bucks from the war profiteering.

And these scumbags didn't take the money and create jobs back here to finance their war machines.

Instead, Halliburton, which is just one company, moved it's operations to Dubai to avoid taxation here.

Other contractors did similar things and often got money wired out of the country to the Caymans, Hong Kong, and other tax shelter nations/markets.

And often the work performed was more than shoddy. These people made billions by doing nothing.
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Postby Huc » Thu Sep 10, 2009 3:23 am

Let me guess. Your friend was enlisted? Here's a small check with numbers. There were approximately 100k soldiers in Iraq. How much would it cost DoD to pay them 44k? 4.4 Billion. That's assuming that they only get paid at that rate. Special Forces get paid about twice that amount, and M1A1 costs about $4.3 million, and replacing broken ones, and maintenance is not cheap. Uparmored Humvees cost 150k if they are built from the ground. And they get attacked a lot too. So I'm not even going to calculate since I don't have exact data, but you can pretty much guess that the cost that DoD has is quite big.

As for your little rant about contractors, please note that most of those contractors earn about 90k - 130k, not 300k a year. Considering that they are the tip of the spear, such costs are not too far from what the DoD has decided to pay SOF forces. And believe it or not, those who make that much money are Americans. There are foreign nationals(Brits, Indonesians etc), but except for Brits, I don't recall that much presence in actual hazardous jobs. The 3rd world country workers get paid less than minimum wage, which is still better than what they were paid in their native country. So all the money that are made by contractors end up coming back home because most are Americans.

The companies using foreign company tax shelters is no different before the war, and while some of it is not taxable it is not correct to say that they are money spent on foreigners since the owners of those companies are Americans.

As for creating job, since when did domestic assistance create more jobs than what contractors are bringing? Contractors don't live frugal life, and they do spend money so it is placed back in to the economy. Welfare checks are no better at producing jobs than what you complain about.

Shoddy work can be found, but the work that contractors did is not exactly shoddy in many areas. There dining service and delivery system is quite effective, even more so than what military can do.
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Postby Spoonbat » Fri Sep 11, 2009 4:30 am

Think about all the military bases that were closed here stateside.....how many local jobs were lost because of that??

Come on man, you know where I'm getting at. :)

And I'm sorry but I really am burned out with politics.

I wish I could continue fighting with you as I used to take pleasure in such things but it is so draining......:P

Maybe clone will debate you if you know anything about SW convention politics or there's always an outsider chance he knows something about Aussie politics or that dazza will get a wild hair up his ass and discuss saffer affairs but I wouldn't bet on that.
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Re: .

Postby Huc » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:37 pm

Spoonbat wrote:Think about all the military bases that were closed here stateside.....how many local jobs were lost because of that??

The number of bases closed was done before the war, now they are more focussed on upgrading and expanding existing bases.

Maybe clone will debate you if you know anything about SW convention politics or there's always an outsider chance he knows something about Aussie politics or that dazza will get a wild hair up his ass and discuss saffer affairs but I wouldn't bet on that.

I agree dazza likes things up his ass. :lol: :wink:
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Postby maverick88 » Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:54 pm

Glenn Beck has been foaming at the mouth for the past few weeks to a month over this video shown to children. In the video she states that it's the governments job to take care of you and I disagree with that, I think the government should give a helping hand when needed but I don't think it's their job to take care of me, so I agree with Beck on that point but being one of the many exploited workers I tend to agree with the rest of the video. I'm also not too sure about the stats she gives in the video. If any one has about 20 minutes to spare, watch the video and post what you think.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/gLBE5QAYXp8&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/gLBE5QAYXp8&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
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